McLaren senior member suspended

The Emperor · 07-04-2007, 03:20 AM

The following statement was issued by McLaren Racing on Tuesday, July 3rd:

"McLaren became aware on the 3rd July 2007 that a senior member of its technical organisation was the subject of a Ferrari investigation regarding the receipt of technical information. The team has learnt that this individual had personally received a package of technical information from a Ferrari employee at the end of April.

Whilst McLaren has no involvement in the matter and condemns such actions it will fully co-operate with any investigation. The individual has in the meanwhile been suspended by the company pending a full and proper investigation of the matter.

No further comment will be made."

In view of the current investigation presently underway involving former Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney regarding questions of suspected sabotage and espionage within the Ferrari team, it is not known if this new information is linked with that ongoing case or if this issue is a separate matter.

Speculation shall now surely begin regarding the identity of the suspended McLaren team senior member.

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Mikael · 07-04-2007, 06:43 AM

Bild, Autosport and Gazzetta dello Sport think it's Mike Coughlan...

Mikael · 07-05-2007, 05:01 AM

BBC News:

McLaren caught in Ferrari spy row

McLaren are embroiled in a spying row following claims one of their leading staff illegally received information from arch-rivals Ferrari.

McLaren suspended a "senior member" of their design team after learning he had "personally received technical information from a Ferrari employee".

The man in question is understood to be chief designer Mike Coughlan.

McLaren said on Wednesday that no other employee had access to the information and that the team had not benefited.

Coughlan was suspended after Ferrari sacked former team manager Nigel Stepney following an internal investigation.

Ferrari believe Stepney stole parts and gave technical information to rivals.

Italian police are investigating Stepney after Ferrari filed a formal complaint with the Modena district attorney, although no charges have been brought.
"We have proof that Stepney had been supplying technical information to a McLaren employee," a Ferrari spokesman said.

"A search was carried out of the (McLaren) engineer's house, where we found this information," he added.

"This is a very serious situation. We are talking about a lot of information being given to a prominent McLaren engineer. We are not talking about rumours or speculation."

McLaren said in a statement on Wednesday: "McLaren has completed a thorough investigation and can confirm that no Ferrari intellectual property has been passed to any other members of the team or incorporated into its cars.

"McLaren has in the meantime openly disclosed these matters to [F1 governing body] the FIA and Ferrari and sought to satisfy any concerns that have arisen from this matter.

"In order to address some of the speculation McLaren has invited the FIA to conduct a full review of its cars to satisfy itself that the team has not benefited from any intellectual property of another competitor."

McLaren's actions are a clear attempt to prevent any potential further action by Ferrari against them, which could potentially include an appeal against some of their results this season.

Coughlan and Stepney worked together at the Benetton team in the early 1990s and later at Ferrari's old UK design studio, which was based in Surrey until 1997.

Stepney has said Ferrari are waging a "dirty tricks campaign" against him.
His lawyer said last month: "Nigel wishes to make clear that he has nothing to do with this and is not guilty of anything."

The development is highly embarrassing for McLaren, whose boss Ron Dennis periodically makes a point of pointing out the nefariousness of rivals who he claims have been caught trying to spy on the team.

McLaren and Ferrari have a long and difficult relationship, and there is an atmosphere of mutual distrust between the two outfits.

The situation may also prove a distraction from McLaren's attempt to win the British Grand Prix this weekend and strengthen their lead in the world championship over Ferrari.

McLaren driver Lewis Hamilton is 14 points clear of team-mate Fernando Alonso in the title chase, with Ferrari drivers Felipe Massa and Kimi Raikkonen three and five points behind the Spaniard.

Stepney joined Ferrari from Benetton in 1992 as chief mechanic, rising to the post of race and test technical manager during the team's period of domination between 2000 and 2004.

He moved to a factory-based role earlier this year after voicing his dissatisfaction over the direction of the team following Michael Schumacher's retirement and Ross Brawn stepping down as technical director.

Imhotep Evil · 07-05-2007, 05:12 AM

This is still much rumors and speculations.

Now I think we need to separate what is a criminal offense here and what is an infraction of the FIA Sporting Regulations. This all centers around intellectual property. That IP would be copyright material owned by Ferrari.

If Coughlan was in possession of anything owned by the Ferrari Corp(?) then it's a criminal case, the type of case being determined by a few factors such as: was it just Coughlan involved or was it any members of the board for McLaren Int.?

If it was just Coughlan, then only he (and Stepney) would face criminal charges in a court of law with real jailtime if convicted. In that scenario, McLaren Int. will be cleared of any wrongdoing (indeed, there is no concern about McLaren Int at this time..it's only Coughlan and Stepney).

The only way Team McLaren (the actual F1 team, not McLaren International) can suffer any penalty from the FIA is if they can be shown to have violated the Formula 1 Regs or the Sporting Regs.

The only part that would apply pertains to running parts designed by another competitor. Ron Dennis was quick to eliminate this by opening up all his car's designs for the FIA to inspect.

The F1 team McLaren is going to be found to be 100% in compliance with the FIA regulations.

This should not be a topic for debate. The team is clean. Now McLaren International may be found guilty of industrial espionage but that is unlikely. As in the Toyota case, the fault, and the punishment, will be limited to the individuals involved (Coughlan and Stepney).

It is a good point that McLaren cant exactly strap Ferrari winglets onto their car.. and that's what they just said in another press release:

"Woking, United Kingdom, 4th July 2007: Following our statement of 3rd July 2007, McLaren has completed a thorough investigation and can confirm that no Ferrari intellectual property has been passed to any other members of the team or incorporated into its cars.

McLaren has in the meanwhile openly disclosed these matters to the FIA and Ferrari and sought to satisfy any concerns that have arisen from this matter. In order to address some of the speculation McLaren has invited the FIA to conduct a full review of its cars to satisfy itself that the team has not benefited from any intellectual property of another competitor."

But then, knowledge is power in sooo many different ways. It is simplistic to assume that there isn't other benefits from stealing information.. I'd imagine the specific information which was found could have a lot to do with the ramifcations.

They're probably going to claim that a disgruntled Stepney gave them the documents in order to try to secure a job next year, with no McLaren hand in thefts or sabotage...

BTW, I hate both Ferrari and McLaren.

Mikael · 07-05-2007, 05:18 AM

But do you think that losing their chief designer will affect McLaren's competitiveness in any way during the current season?

Imhotep Evil · 07-05-2007, 05:24 AM

A running car isn't designed during the run of the season, merely optimized/evolved/developed/improved.

This could:

a) affect McMerc if the rest do not understand properly what Coughlan has done in the MP4/22.
However this is unlikely, since the MP4-22 is and evolution/optimization of the MP4-21, witch was designed by Newey.

b) be more likely to affect the 2008 car.

Mikael · 07-05-2007, 06:10 AM

And the information Coughlan got could maybe help them next season but not with the current car because it's so different compared to the F2007, right?

Imhotep Evil · 07-05-2007, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmer

And the information Coughlan got could maybe help them next season but not with the current car because it's so different compared to the F2007, right?

In a way it could be correct, if suposing the new car would be different (in some areas at least) that the current one. But we don't know the relation between the 07 and upcoming car(s).

Simply put, if you slap, say, Ferrari winglets on a McMerc chassis, they won't improve the McMerc, quite possible it could lead to a disaster considering they are so different.

So far only rumors and speculations.

450SEL6.9 · 07-06-2007, 08:32 AM

This "probe" will go nowhere! No one will get punished, no points will be docked, nothing will come of this.

F1, as a business, wants to have Hamilton win the title. Bernie's statements that the drivers will not be docked points, because they didn't know about the spy scandal, is meant to protect the top asset in F1, in my opinion. So many teams have used illegal fuel, illegal parts in the past, allegedly without the driver "knowing". Still, the drivers were docked points. They are of course different infractions, but I just want to question why Bernie supposedly sounds so quick in distancing the drivers from the teams.

I always hated Mclaren, but this episode makes me question my support for Ferrari as well. Stepney was an important member of the team. He got hurt in a pitstop and worked for them many years. I still think Ferrari forced out Schumacher for overrated Kimi. Perhaps Ferrari doesn't deserve to be portrayed as a victim.

Imhotep Evil · 07-06-2007, 08:56 AM

I heard that it was an employee (McLaren's ?!) that saw the Ferrari logo on the documents and anounced Ferrari.

I do agree that FIA wants Hamilton to win the title.

07-04-2007, 03:20 AM	#1 (permalink)
The Emperor Malicious Persecutor Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Where noone has gone before... Posts: 9,141 My Mood: Thanks: 1,405 Thanked 1,567 Times in 952 Posts	McLaren senior member suspended The following statement was issued by McLaren Racing on Tuesday, July 3rd: "McLaren became aware on the 3rd July 2007 that a senior member of its technical organisation was the subject of a Ferrari investigation regarding the receipt of technical information. The team has learnt that this individual had personally received a package of technical information from a Ferrari employee at the end of April. Whilst McLaren has no involvement in the matter and condemns such actions it will fully co-operate with any investigation. The individual has in the meanwhile been suspended by the company pending a full and proper investigation of the matter. No further comment will be made." In view of the current investigation presently underway involving former Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney regarding questions of suspected sabotage and espionage within the Ferrari team, it is not known if this new information is linked with that ongoing case or if this issue is a separate matter. Speculation shall now surely begin regarding the identity of the suspended McLaren team senior member. Source: - ONLY REGISTERED AND ACTIVATED USERS CAN SEE ALL LINKS - CLICK HERE TO REGISTER

07-04-2007, 06:43 AM	#2 (permalink)
Mikael Moderator Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,838 Thanks: 739 Thanked 311 Times in 199 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended Bild, Autosport and Gazzetta dello Sport think it's Mike Coughlan...

07-05-2007, 05:01 AM	#3 (permalink)
Mikael Moderator Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,838 Thanks: 739 Thanked 311 Times in 199 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended BBC News: McLaren caught in Ferrari spy row McLaren are embroiled in a spying row following claims one of their leading staff illegally received information from arch-rivals Ferrari. McLaren suspended a "senior member" of their design team after learning he had "personally received technical information from a Ferrari employee". The man in question is understood to be chief designer Mike Coughlan. McLaren said on Wednesday that no other employee had access to the information and that the team had not benefited. Coughlan was suspended after Ferrari sacked former team manager Nigel Stepney following an internal investigation. Ferrari believe Stepney stole parts and gave technical information to rivals. Italian police are investigating Stepney after Ferrari filed a formal complaint with the Modena district attorney, although no charges have been brought. "We have proof that Stepney had been supplying technical information to a McLaren employee," a Ferrari spokesman said. "A search was carried out of the (McLaren) engineer's house, where we found this information," he added. "This is a very serious situation. We are talking about a lot of information being given to a prominent McLaren engineer. We are not talking about rumours or speculation." McLaren said in a statement on Wednesday: "McLaren has completed a thorough investigation and can confirm that no Ferrari intellectual property has been passed to any other members of the team or incorporated into its cars. "McLaren has in the meantime openly disclosed these matters to [F1 governing body] the FIA and Ferrari and sought to satisfy any concerns that have arisen from this matter. "In order to address some of the speculation McLaren has invited the FIA to conduct a full review of its cars to satisfy itself that the team has not benefited from any intellectual property of another competitor." McLaren's actions are a clear attempt to prevent any potential further action by Ferrari against them, which could potentially include an appeal against some of their results this season. Coughlan and Stepney worked together at the Benetton team in the early 1990s and later at Ferrari's old UK design studio, which was based in Surrey until 1997. Stepney has said Ferrari are waging a "dirty tricks campaign" against him. His lawyer said last month: "Nigel wishes to make clear that he has nothing to do with this and is not guilty of anything." The development is highly embarrassing for McLaren, whose boss Ron Dennis periodically makes a point of pointing out the nefariousness of rivals who he claims have been caught trying to spy on the team. McLaren and Ferrari have a long and difficult relationship, and there is an atmosphere of mutual distrust between the two outfits. The situation may also prove a distraction from McLaren's attempt to win the British Grand Prix this weekend and strengthen their lead in the world championship over Ferrari. McLaren driver Lewis Hamilton is 14 points clear of team-mate Fernando Alonso in the title chase, with Ferrari drivers Felipe Massa and Kimi Raikkonen three and five points behind the Spaniard. Stepney joined Ferrari from Benetton in 1992 as chief mechanic, rising to the post of race and test technical manager during the team's period of domination between 2000 and 2004. He moved to a factory-based role earlier this year after voicing his dissatisfaction over the direction of the team following Michael Schumacher's retirement and Ross Brawn stepping down as technical director.

07-05-2007, 05:12 AM	#4 (permalink)
Imhotep Evil Devotee Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 3,889 Thanks: 248 Thanked 150 Times in 113 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended This is still much rumors and speculations. Now I think we need to separate what is a criminal offense here and what is an infraction of the FIA Sporting Regulations. This all centers around intellectual property. That IP would be copyright material owned by Ferrari. If Coughlan was in possession of anything owned by the Ferrari Corp(?) then it's a criminal case, the type of case being determined by a few factors such as: was it just Coughlan involved or was it any members of the board for McLaren Int.? If it was just Coughlan, then only he (and Stepney) would face criminal charges in a court of law with real jailtime if convicted. In that scenario, McLaren Int. will be cleared of any wrongdoing (indeed, there is no concern about McLaren Int at this time..it's only Coughlan and Stepney). The only way Team McLaren (the actual F1 team, not McLaren International) can suffer any penalty from the FIA is if they can be shown to have violated the Formula 1 Regs or the Sporting Regs. The only part that would apply pertains to running parts designed by another competitor. Ron Dennis was quick to eliminate this by opening up all his car's designs for the FIA to inspect. The F1 team McLaren is going to be found to be 100% in compliance with the FIA regulations. This should not be a topic for debate. The team is clean. Now McLaren International may be found guilty of industrial espionage but that is unlikely. As in the Toyota case, the fault, and the punishment, will be limited to the individuals involved (Coughlan and Stepney). It is a good point that McLaren cant exactly strap Ferrari winglets onto their car.. and that's what they just said in another press release: "Woking, United Kingdom, 4th July 2007: Following our statement of 3rd July 2007, McLaren has completed a thorough investigation and can confirm that no Ferrari intellectual property has been passed to any other members of the team or incorporated into its cars. McLaren has in the meanwhile openly disclosed these matters to the FIA and Ferrari and sought to satisfy any concerns that have arisen from this matter. In order to address some of the speculation McLaren has invited the FIA to conduct a full review of its cars to satisfy itself that the team has not benefited from any intellectual property of another competitor." But then, knowledge is power in sooo many different ways. It is simplistic to assume that there isn't other benefits from stealing information.. I'd imagine the specific information which was found could have a lot to do with the ramifcations. They're probably going to claim that a disgruntled Stepney gave them the documents in order to try to secure a job next year, with no McLaren hand in thefts or sabotage... BTW, I hate both Ferrari and McLaren.

07-05-2007, 05:18 AM	#5 (permalink)
Mikael Moderator Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,838 Thanks: 739 Thanked 311 Times in 199 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended But do you think that losing their chief designer will affect McLaren's competitiveness in any way during the current season?

07-05-2007, 05:24 AM	#6 (permalink)
Imhotep Evil Devotee Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 3,889 Thanks: 248 Thanked 150 Times in 113 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended A running car isn't designed during the run of the season, merely optimized/evolved/developed/improved. This could: a) affect McMerc if the rest do not understand properly what Coughlan has done in the MP4/22. However this is unlikely, since the MP4-22 is and evolution/optimization of the MP4-21, witch was designed by Newey. b) be more likely to affect the 2008 car.

07-05-2007, 06:10 AM	#7 (permalink)
Mikael Moderator Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,838 Thanks: 739 Thanked 311 Times in 199 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended And the information Coughlan got could maybe help them next season but not with the current car because it's so different compared to the F2007, right?

07-06-2007, 08:32 AM	#9 (permalink)
450SEL6.9 Inactive Account Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 825 My Mood: Thanks: 57 Thanked 60 Times in 54 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended This "probe" will go nowhere! No one will get punished, no points will be docked, nothing will come of this. F1, as a business, wants to have Hamilton win the title. Bernie's statements that the drivers will not be docked points, because they didn't know about the spy scandal, is meant to protect the top asset in F1, in my opinion. So many teams have used illegal fuel, illegal parts in the past, allegedly without the driver "knowing". Still, the drivers were docked points. They are of course different infractions, but I just want to question why Bernie supposedly sounds so quick in distancing the drivers from the teams. I always hated Mclaren, but this episode makes me question my support for Ferrari as well. Stepney was an important member of the team. He got hurt in a pitstop and worked for them many years. I still think Ferrari forced out Schumacher for overrated Kimi. Perhaps Ferrari doesn't deserve to be portrayed as a victim. Last edited by 450SEL6.9; 07-06-2007 at 08:52 AM.

07-06-2007, 08:56 AM	#10 (permalink)
Imhotep Evil Devotee Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 3,889 Thanks: 248 Thanked 150 Times in 113 Posts	Re: McLaren senior member suspended I heard that it was an employee (McLaren's ?!) that saw the Ferrari logo on the documents and anounced Ferrari. I do agree that FIA wants Hamilton to win the title.

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